whovian
Junior Grey Lover
River (a.k.a Iruska Cool Chic) has claimed me as her "friendbeast"
Posts: 171
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Crying
Nov 14, 2013 7:05:17 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by whovian on Nov 14, 2013 7:05:17 GMT -5
Hello!
I expect that this is another situation where I have spoiled River, and need to learn to be more hard-nosed. Nevertheless, I am out of ideas on how to do that.
So far, in the 2.5 months I have had her, River has slept in her crate in the room I use as my study. There are several reasons for this:
1. My bedroom is further down the uncarpeted hallway, and I would need to buy more runners than I can afford for her to get to it independently. The vet recommended that I not push the hardwood floors thing until March when her leg is 100% healed
2. My bedroom is only barely big enough for my Queen size and putting a bed or crate in there would make things a fire hazard. I would have to climb over the crate to get out the door. If I just let her sleep on her bed, I would be afraid that I would step on her.
3. I have dog allergies.
There is only a thin wall between her crate and my head in bed so I can hear her and I am sure she can hear me at night.
After that long preamble, here is my problem. For the last 3 weeks River has been crying in the morning starting at 5 am. I have tried to be consistent about when I get up, (7) regardless of whether or not she cries, but it hasn't helped.
I think the fact that I eventually get up after she has been crying rewards the behavior, and she will just keep crying for as long as it takes. She did not do this before I started taking her for walks - when she was still healing, she was content to sleep until I got up.
Should I stop taking her for morning walks? How can I get her to sleep until a reasonable hour?
Right now having her sleep in the bedroom is really not an option, unless I make Andrew move out and start sleeping in a twin size bed. Which I would rather not do, but at the same time it would be nice to get some sleep...
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Crying
Nov 14, 2013 17:26:13 GMT -5
Post by Mag's Mom on Nov 14, 2013 17:26:13 GMT -5
Hi, I wonder if you could take her out later in the evening to relieve herself and then maybe she could hold it longer. Or, if that's not her issue, could you let her sleep on her bed outside of your room in the hallway without her crate and just adjust the runners that you have? I'm relatively new, so I'm sure you will get more useful advice. I wish you all the best with this...these guys are sure rascals.
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Post by Heather (& KC) on Nov 14, 2013 21:30:04 GMT -5
Question for you. When you get up with her, does she need to go to the bathroom? I'd tend to get up, take her out and then return her to her crate without any "celebration". I would want to ensure it isn't a bladder issue.
I like the idea of putting her on a pillow outside room. It is funny, Thunder will mostly choose to sleep outside the bedroom (unless he is on the bed with me when hubby is at work) but he does like to come and check on us. I know your situation is complicated by her leg and your floors.
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whovian
Junior Grey Lover
River (a.k.a Iruska Cool Chic) has claimed me as her "friendbeast"
Posts: 171
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Post by whovian on Nov 15, 2013 7:33:47 GMT -5
I was fairly sure that it wasn't a bladder issue, but when she started crying this morning, I took her outside to see. She did not want to go outside at first, but peed when we got into the yard. She went back in her crate "without ceremony," and I went back to bed. After about 5 min she was howling again.
Sigh, I was really hoping it was a bladder issue. I took her out at midnight before I went to bed and woke up around 6 to let her out.
I am wary of letting her sleep uncrated at night for the time being because she tries to get adventurous when she is by herself. Andrew forgot to lock the crate one night last week and I woke up to find her at the kitchen sink mat. She had clearly been counter surfing, and must have slipped on the tile floor. She'd scrambled to the sink mat but was then on a carpet island in the kitchen, unable to cross the 6 feet of slippery kitchen floor to get back to her usual runners. Not only had she hurt herself (her foot was swollen again for a few days) but she had taken out her frustrations by chewing on the sink cupboard doors.
I don't know how to make the house safe enough for her so that she can sleep outside her crate and I can sleep peacefully knowing she hasn't hurt herself or started chewing on things. She doesn't like it when I move the runners that she already has, but maybe I could try moving them so that she has a path to our bedroom every night? The door into our bedroom is around the corner so its about 25 feet away from her runner sanctuary.
She doesn't cry or get upset when home alone during the day, and doesn't display any other signs of separation anxiety. So this morning crying thing is a mystery to me.
I am also wondering if maybe she is hungry. We've increased her activity level now from 10 to 15 min of activity to 40 min of walking every day, but I haven't increased her kibble dosage by much (1.75 cups 2 x daily to to a total of 3.75 cups). Her weight has remained stable, but she is putting some muscle mass back on that she lost during her 6 months of inactivity.
I also wonder if she gets cold at night now that it's colder and that that is the source of the crying. The house is set to 19 degrees at night, and 21 during the day but her room has a north facing window. I have no idea how to tell if dog is cold though, only ever having owned labs before River. How do you tell?
I should also probably mention that River really likes her crate. She chooses to sleep in there over her other beds 90% of the time during the day. She also cries if I have asked her to kennel up and she thinks I am about to leave without shutting the kennel door. She visibly relaxes each time when the door is shut and locked and has ever since I brought her home over Labour Day weekend.
She stopped crying at 7:15, 15 min after I would usually get up (I am still in bed) and I suspect she is sound asleep now. It's the strangest thing.
Sent from my SGH-I747M using proboards
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Crying
Nov 15, 2013 11:13:25 GMT -5
Post by Mag's Mom on Nov 15, 2013 11:13:25 GMT -5
I wonder if you might just take her to the vet to check about a bladder infection, especially since this is relatively new occurrence and she has such a special circumstances with her leg. Poor River (and poor you), I hope you can get some more ideas.
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ceedee
Junior Grey Lover
Posts: 187
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Crying
Nov 15, 2013 12:22:24 GMT -5
Post by ceedee on Nov 15, 2013 12:22:24 GMT -5
When we first got Allie, she slept in her crate in the sunroom off the kitchen, far from our bedroom upstairs. My husband has always had a "no dogs, cats in the bedroom" rule because of his allergies. For the first three days I slept on the floor beside her crate to comfort her when she cried. After that she settled nicely for the night in her crate. If she cried or whined before we got up (and we had already ruled out that she didn't need to go out for a pee), a firm "NO" and "Lie Down" were effective in keeping her quiet. We were persistent in doing this, and now she never wakes us up until we are ready to get up, and she doesn't use a crate anymore but still sleeps on her cushions downstairs and has never yearned to sleep beside us. River doesn't seem ready to be out of her crate for the night, so try just being firm with her with "NO" commands when she whines. Greyhounds are pretty smart pups and she'll get the message. I know this isn't dog psychology and some will not agree with this tough love approach, but it worked for us and we have a wonderful and affectionate girl who fits into the rhythm of our lifestyle and we love her to bits.
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Crying
Nov 15, 2013 16:47:15 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by lovinfroggy on Nov 15, 2013 16:47:15 GMT -5
I don't have any real experience, but just wanted to mention baby gates as a way to keep your pup in/out of areas. Also, our girl has elected our small closet as her bed. It's just your typical closet with a sliding door. This came about after a thunderstorm one night and Frog really wanted to hide. Luckily it's the side that belongs to my fiancé and it's just his dress shirts hanging there. Perhaps that could work.
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OwnedBySummer
Hound Nut
"Summer" (aka Coach Standifer)
Posts: 1,392
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Crying
Nov 17, 2013 11:02:55 GMT -5
Post by OwnedBySummer on Nov 17, 2013 11:02:55 GMT -5
She very well may be cold. It's pretty easy to tell with a greyhound. Are her ears cold? Also, is she curled up in a ball-o-hound? Even in the evening, well before bed, when I see my girl consistently curling up, I'll put something on her. Sure enough, within a couple of minutes, she'll be stretched out normally again. I have jammies in various weights, depending on the temperature and what we're doing (home? camping? hotel?). In the cold weather, I keep the house at 69F during the day and 65F at night and have no trouble as long as she has jammies on at night (and if it's extra bitter outside, she will wear a sweatshirt or something around during the day).
I've also always had my dogs sleep in my bedroom and on my bed. Greyhounds generally really want to do that. I realize you have a space issue but is there nothing you could do to get a bed in there?
I picked up some cheap runners at Giant Tiger -- perhaps you could swing some more? And if you don't want her wandering about at night, can you not use a babygate? You could try babygating her into that other bedroom without closing her in a crate (I wouldn't shut the bedroom door) or babygate her into your bedroom with you. I close my bedroom door at night and she's in there with me but my bedroom is larger so it doesn't get stuffy or close.
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whovian
Junior Grey Lover
River (a.k.a Iruska Cool Chic) has claimed me as her "friendbeast"
Posts: 171
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Crying
Nov 17, 2013 18:13:20 GMT -5
Post by whovian on Nov 17, 2013 18:13:20 GMT -5
Thank you everyone for the input. It's great to have so much feedback! River slept in until 7 am both mornings this weekend, which was a blessing. So far there is more evidence building for my hypothesis that she is crying because she is cold. It has been warmer this weekend, and so the draft in the room where she sleeps hasn't been as bad. I have some PJs that she can wear, so maybe I will try that when the temperature outside drops again and we'll see if that helps. Dunnrunnin - yes, when I get up in the morning, she is curled into the tiniest ball that she could possibly be in. I never thought to feel her ears, but I will try that next time. When I drape a blanket over her she doesn't complain, but I wouldn't call her expression "thankful" either - more like tolerant. But maybe she appreciates the gesture more than I realize. ceedee - I have been trying out your suggestion of firmly telling River to be quiet when she cries and then returning to bed. She does seem to be getting the idea that the crying isn't something we like around the house. She is a pretty quick learner. I can't call River a cuddlebug, exactly, as she likes to keep to herself when she is sleeping and moves off the couch to her bed if we sit down with her. She really likes cuddling with her teddy, however, so I wondered if maybe I could make him a safe sleeping buddy for her at night. She's never made any move to shred him, but I'd hate to wake up and find her choking on stuffing. So I took her teddy and "dressed" him up in some old clothes of mine after I wore them around all day on Friday. The t-shirt and shorts cover him so that there is an extra layer of fabric over his fur. Her teeth aren't very strong - she's never managed to put a hole in any of her toys, even when she is trying, and only put a few dents in the cupboard door that she chewed - so for now I am hoping that my clothing teddy armour will keep her out of the stuffing for a while. I've been letting her sleep with him on a trial basis when I am around. She seems to like her Teddy pillow and snuggled right up aginst his smelly people clothes right away. I think he might help keep her warm too. But I am really worried about her chewing on him. Like I said, I grew up owning Labs, and I know how much damage a dog can do to a toy in about 5 seconds. I also know how tasty, for some dogs at least, stuffing can be. Is letting her sleep with her stuffed toys unsupervised a bad idea? The closest she's ever come to damaging Humphrey Bogart the bear is when she put a small hole in his foot by licking it. I am fairly sure she licked the fur right off him. Then when the stuffing poked out, she cried and moved to the other side of the crate and looked at me until I came over and examined his wound. She was very concerned, and hovered over me the entire time I performed emergency surgery on the tiny hole. There has been no Humphrey licking since, and that was before the t-shirt armour. Still, I worry. If a stuffy sleeping mate is a bad idea, would a pillow be a better option? I thought about getting her one of those backrest pillows with arms that's made for sitting up in bed. She likes to use Humphrey's legs as a pillow, and I thought maybe the arms on one of those backrest pillows would function the same way. I could still even wrap it in one of my smelly old pillow cases. I really wish that there was a way we could make it work for River to sleep in our room, but between my allergies and asthma and Andrew's absolute "no dogs in the bedroom" rule, it would just be a bad show all around. Her situation isn't so terrible though - Andrew is a night hawk and works in the study until 3 am most nights and I get up at 7 am. I suspect that this is likely also a part of the crying problem. I am hopeful that it is a quick phase that she will grow out of soon. I also take it as a compliment - it's nice to know that she is warming up to us, so much so that she misses us when we are out of the room In the meantime, I've dropped hints to all my family and friends that we'd really like a collection of area rugs and runners for Christmas this year.
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Crying
Nov 17, 2013 19:41:24 GMT -5
Post by rubylottie14 on Nov 17, 2013 19:41:24 GMT -5
I see bits of carpet outside people's houses quite often just waiting to be collected by the bin men - I've also seen carpet off cuts in skips round the back of carpet shops - I'm sure you could find some free carpet pieces if you had a look around your area. Shops will also sell small bits off cheaply if 2nd hand throw outs freak you out. I've been told that dogs can be ok left in a different room as long as they can see you and the door isn't closed - so the babygate thing is a good idea. Good luck, I hate to hear a dog crying - makes me incredibly tense.
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Crying
Nov 19, 2013 12:05:09 GMT -5
Post by dunnrunnin on Nov 19, 2013 12:05:09 GMT -5
I was just about to suggest using an old T shirt or sweatshirt that smells of your scent for her to cuddle with, much like a security blankie. A dressed up teddy sounds like it is doing the trick! I made the 'mistake' of leaving a sweatshirt of mine on a chair one day when I left for work...and found it in her crate when I came home (she has free roam of my house, but obviously must spend time in her open crate while I'm gone). I had an "aha" moment, and now it has become a game of sorts. Every day, I'll leave it draped over the same chair, and every day I find it on the loveseat, her dog bed or in her crate. Some days I make it abit more difficult/challenging and tie a sleeve to the chair. I used to tie both sleeves to the chair, but came home 1 day to find the whole chair, w/ the sweatshirt still attached, dragged over to her dogbed across the room. Lesson learned... What time is she fed her breakfast? She may be waking up hungry. Could you try maybe giving her a sm. handful of kibbles or a couple treats @ bedtime to see if that helps tide her over until breakfast?
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whovian
Junior Grey Lover
River (a.k.a Iruska Cool Chic) has claimed me as her "friendbeast"
Posts: 171
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Crying
Nov 22, 2013 10:57:22 GMT -5
Post by whovian on Nov 22, 2013 10:57:22 GMT -5
It's been 1 week now since her crying last woke me up before 7. She will still cry starting at 7 am, but that's when my alarm goes off anyway. She only starts crying when she knows that I am lying in bed, awake, after hitting the snooze button. Sleeping with Humphrey Bogart the Bear appears to be doing the trick. She has not damaged him in any way, and even though I am still nervous about leaving her alone with a giant stuffy, she hasn't shown any interest in chewing or licking him in the last week. I need to wash his t-shirt armour now, but then I can trade it out for another old t-shirt that I've worn. I also slept with one of her clean dog blankets so it would smell like me before I put it back in her crate, and I woke up to find her curled up in it, sound asleep the other morning. So yes, dunnrunnin, stinky people clothes seem to be helping a lot. I have not tried giving her food at bedtime, but she is definitely waking up hungry. When I get up in the morning she goes right to her bowl and stares at it until I get the point. I will try feeing her at bedtime and see if she is less urgent about her breakfast in the morning. I have been working towards leaving her crate door open at night. I set up a baby gate in the doorway of the study so that she can't get out into the kitchen. She will still be confined to one room at night, but at least she won't be able to get stuck on Rug Island. The only problem is that she is TERRIFIED of the baby gate, and wouldn't come out of her crate when I first set it up. So I've been trying to get her used to it in small chunks by doing everything else that I would normally do (say that I am going away or going to bed, give her a treat, shut the crate door) and then setting up the baby gate in the doorway. She can still see it, but nothing else has changed in her routine. Yesterday she was brave enough come out of her crate and sniff it a little before I took it down when I got home, so we are making progress. Again, thank you everyone for the help. It's nice to get a good night's sleep again.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Crying
Nov 22, 2013 11:48:41 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2013 11:48:41 GMT -5
for what it's worth - everything in our world is new to greyhounds including a baby gate which they most likely have never seen before so I wouldn't worry if she's nervous of it at first. I have six hounds in the house and my most recent addition "salem pete" howls 'till the windows shake when I return home from my bus run everymorning. there are five other dogs sleeping beside him! silly boy! I have found that if I completely ignore him for the first five minutes in the house he quiets down. I'm not ready to let him out of his crate just yet as he tends to like to nibble the walls! because I'm up at the crack of dawn on week days, he's quiet but god forbid I try to sleep in on the week-ends, not gonna happen! I've had him for 4 months now and he's still learning my routine even thou the other dogs don't make a peep! sorry for the ramble, hope this helped in some way. Martha
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sandysfarm
Grey Lover
positive reinforcement is theElegantSolution
Posts: 676
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Post by sandysfarm on Jan 5, 2014 15:16:39 GMT -5
error
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sandysfarm
Grey Lover
positive reinforcement is theElegantSolution
Posts: 676
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Crying
Jan 5, 2014 15:17:01 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by sandysfarm on Jan 5, 2014 15:17:01 GMT -5
Thank you everyone for the input. It's great to have so much feedback! River slept in until 7 am both mornings this weekend, which was a blessing. So far there is more evidence building for my hypothesis that she is crying because she is cold. It has been warmer this weekend, and so the draft in the room where she sleeps hasn't been as bad. I have some PJs that she can wear, so maybe I will try that when the temperature outside drops again and we'll see if that helps. Dunnrunnin - yes, when I get up in the morning, she is curled into the tiniest ball that she could possibly be in. I never thought to feel her ears, but I will try that next time. When I drape a blanket over her she doesn't complain, but I wouldn't call her expression "thankful" either - more like tolerant. But maybe she appreciates the gesture more than I realize. ceedee - I have been trying out your suggestion of firmly telling River to be quiet when she cries and then returning to bed. She does seem to be getting the idea that the crying isn't something we like around the house. She is a pretty quick learner. I can't call River a cuddlebug, exactly, as she likes to keep to herself when she is sleeping and moves off the couch to her bed if we sit down with her. She really likes cuddling with her teddy, however, so I wondered if maybe I could make him a safe sleeping buddy for her at night. She's never made any move to shred him, but I'd hate to wake up and find her choking on stuffing. So I took her teddy and "dressed" him up in some old clothes of mine after I wore them around all day on Friday. The t-shirt and shorts cover him so that there is an extra layer of fabric over his fur. Her teeth aren't very strong - she's never managed to put a hole in any of her toys, even when she is trying, and only put a few dents in the cupboard door that she chewed - so for now I am hoping that my clothing teddy armour will keep her out of the stuffing for a while. I've been letting her sleep with him on a trial basis when I am around. She seems to like her Teddy pillow and snuggled right up aginst his smelly people clothes right away. I think he might help keep her warm too. But I am really worried about her chewing on him. Like I said, I grew up owning Labs, and I know how much damage a dog can do to a toy in about 5 seconds. I also know how tasty, for some dogs at least, stuffing can be. Is letting her sleep with her stuffed toys unsupervised a bad idea? The closest she's ever come to damaging Humphrey Bogart the bear is when she put a small hole in his foot by licking it. I am fairly sure she licked the fur right off him. Then when the stuffing poked out, she cried and moved to the other side of the crate and looked at me until I came over and examined his wound. She was very concerned, and hovered over me the entire time I performed emergency surgery on the tiny hole. There has been no Humphrey licking since, and that was before the t-shirt armour. Still, I worry. If a stuffy sleeping mate is a bad idea, would a pillow be a better option? I thought about getting her one of those backrest pillows with arms that's made for sitting up in bed. She likes to use Humphrey's legs as a pillow, and I thought maybe the arms on one of those backrest pillows would function the same way. I could still even wrap it in one of my smelly old pillow cases. I really wish that there was a way we could make it work for River to sleep in our room, but between my allergies and asthma and Andrew's absolute "no dogs in the bedroom" rule, it would just be a bad show all around. Her situation isn't so terrible though - Andrew is a night hawk and works in the study until 3 am most nights and I get up at 7 am. I suspect that this is likely also a part of the crying problem. I am hopeful that it is a quick phase that she will grow out of soon. I also take it as a compliment - it's nice to know that she is warming up to us, so much so that she misses us when we are out of the room In the meantime, I've dropped hints to all my family and friends that we'd really like a collection of area rugs and runners for Christmas this year. I'd keep her warmer - shes not as able to move around in her crate so she's captive to the ambient temp- and I'd also give her a snack as you tuck her in for the night. I used to give half a cup of warm oatmeal to a new hound I had who would burn off calories faster than the other dogs and then get cold and twitchy - which reminded him... maybe he had to pee ....at 5 am. I dont do mornings well so I had to figure him out fast before it affected my other dogs...
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