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Post by sarajean66 on Sept 7, 2013 21:02:57 GMT -5
So sad that this has happened! My boyfriend was giving Rosie attention on the couch, giving her kisses, petting her head. He leaned in close to her face, and without warning (no previous growling), she bit his lip. There was a huge gash! We rushed to the urgent care centre, and he needed 7 stitches to close the wound.
I am completely shocked, she is so docile in every other aspect of her life..... what do i do!!? Should we not let her around our young nieces and nephews? She's only 2 years old, should i be worried about having children in the potential near future with her in the household!? I had put her in the crate when we left and she pooped and peed everywhere/on herself in the few hours we were gone, even though i let her out immediately before we left.
She is keeping her distance from us now, she knows she has done something wrong, i'm assuming by the vibe in the house.
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Post by angelollie on Sept 7, 2013 22:11:40 GMT -5
Most dogs, of any breed, do not like to be hugged or kissed on the face, etc. Many dogs, including greyhounds, may warm up to this eventually but for the first few months donโt let any child, yours or others do this. Most dogs would rather be scratched on the chest. They see a hand coming over the head or a face too close to her face as threatening, especially from a person their own size. Greyhounds have only had a crate to call their own so are not used to having someone (another dog or human) being so close within their own space. Even though Rosie was on the couch it is obvious she still sees this as an invasion of her space. There are humans that react this way too (a person may feel uncomfortable when another person gets within their circle).
I definitely do not see this situation as being a sign of aggression on Rosie's part. She obviously is very upset and confused by having an accident while you were gone, but she probably doesn't understand what she did wrong.
As for your nieces and nephews, it will be your responsibility to teach them not to crowd Rosie, or put their arms around her neck, or go close to her while she is sleeping. This should apply to any dog, not just a greyhound. If you are uncomfortable with the kids around Rosie, then put her muzzle on.
I hope some of this helps you .... I know others will chime in as well.
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Post by sandysfa on Sept 7, 2013 22:38:23 GMT -5
Hi - trainer here, so I thought maybe I could be of some help. She didn't do anything wrong, you did - unknowingly possibly,...but you need to be a bit more up to snuff on dog management. It's never appropriate to put your face down to nuzzle a dog. This has nothing to do with age or breed - it's just too aggressive in dog psychology. All dogs, regardless of their age, breed or temperament will flinch away in discomfort if you do that to them and the newer, less experienced ones may well react by snapping at you to make you back off. Unfortunately, yours made contact when she snapped but the reason would be the same. If your feelings are hurt and you're annoyed at her, remember that she is not people; she is in a new environment that she is trying to learn; she is all by herself with no other dog support for the first time in her life and you frightened her enough to make her react. Yes you should keep her away from little kids and anyone else who is not dog-savvy enough to accidentally intimidate her...until she and you have had lots of time to acclimatize...stay off of her bed; give her private time and space that she can count on to de-stress when she needs it - and she will - Don't let her on the sofa or in the bed with you for a good long time - a nice comfy dog throw on the floor is fine. And if you're giving her attitude because she was 'bad' you need to check this site for all the gh reading material that is listed and read it. Get yourself to some of the runs, talk to other adopters and you'll discover that many dogs have had the same issues settling in and that the more you learn the easier the fit Post here whenever you need help and read, read, read!! We're here to help even though it might seem like tough love for the first while...
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Post by sandysfa on Sept 7, 2013 22:40:45 GMT -5
You see what I mean? . We're both typing at the same time and the words are remarkably the same, yes? more coming, Im sure...
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Post by sarajean66 on Sept 8, 2013 5:03:34 GMT -5
thank you so much for the help. I'm sad to think that we made her feel so threatened that she needed to respond in such a negative way. It's definitely an eye opener, my family has had pets most of my life, but this just shows as new dog owners our lack of experience. I am very relieved that you guys do not see this as a sign of aggression. I hope this at least will be able to help some of the new greyhound owners as well.
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sandysfarm
Grey Lover
positive reinforcement is theElegantSolution
Posts: 676
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Post by sandysfarm on Sept 8, 2013 7:30:06 GMT -5
Think of this as the beginning of a long and fascinating conversation about how a dog really works. You don't have to be sad that you made a mistake as long as you use your new information to her benefit. People who are good at stuff have trial and error under their belts and now you have some too. Here's what you know: greyhounds come to you in the raw. They are forced to adapt to a new house, new yard, leash, new owners, relatives of the owners, different bedding, food , new noises, schedules...and "abandonment" - because we simply walk out on them when we feel like it to live our life. And it's all so overwhelming for the poor little ducks that what you get from them pretty consistently in the beginning is a) "get outta my face", and b) "I'm all alone and totally freaking" (snap and poop) Read Greyhounds for Dummies to start and maybe angelollie wouldn't mind directing you to more and keep posting here. It'll be fine, just take it super easy with her and keep track of what you're learning.
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Post by sarajean66 on Sept 8, 2013 14:54:07 GMT -5
greyhound for dummies has been ordered once again, thanks for the great advice.
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Post by rubylottie14 on Sept 8, 2013 18:49:34 GMT -5
I've had to learn from scratch since I was never brought up with pet dogs, so if I can do it, so can you. I've made mistakes and I'm sure I'll make some in the future. The key is to learn from them. I'm lucky in that all my greyhounds have been fine with me cuddling them etc though I did learn that Zak wasn't keen so I left him alone. I also learned that if a dog is in pain they want you to leave them alone - pretty obvious really. Gerry certainly needed space when he got bone cancer - my friend made the mistake of crowding him and he bit her - at the time we didn't know he had bone cancer in both his right front leg and left hip. I thought at the time E was being daft but she doesn't listen.
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Post by angelollie on Sept 8, 2013 20:46:43 GMT -5
No Fear No Pain by Kathleen Gilley
Of all breeds of dogs, the ex-racing Greyhound has never had to be responsible for anything in his life. His whole existence has been a dog-centered one. This breed has never been asked to do anything for itself, make any decisions or answer any questions. It has been waited on, paw and tail. The only prohibition in a racing Greyhound's life is not to get into a fight----------------or eat certain stuff in the turn out pen.
Let us review a little. From weaning until you go away for schooling, at probably a year and a half, you eat, grow and run around with your siblings. When you go away to begin your racing career, you get your own "apartment," in a large housing development. No one is allowed in your bed but you, and when you are in there, no one can touch you, without plenty of warning.
Someone hears a vehicle drive up, or the kennel door being unlocked. The light switches are flipped on. The loud mouths in residence, and there always are some, begin to bark or howl. You are wide awake by the time the human opens your door to turn you out. A Greyhound has never been touched while he was asleep.
You eat when you are fed, usually on a strict schedule. No one asks if you are hungry or what you want to eat. You are never told not to eat any food within your reach. No one ever touches your bowl while you are eating. You are not to be disturbed because it is important you clean your plate.
You are not asked if you have to "go outside." You are placed in a turn out pen and it isn't long before you get the idea of what you are supposed to do while you are out there. Unless you really get out of hand, you may chase, rough house and put your feet on everyone and every thing else. The only humans you know are the "waiters" who feed you, and the "restroom attendants" who turn you out to go to the bathroom. Respect people? Surely you jest.
No one comes into or goes out of your kennel without your knowledge. You are all seeing; all knowing. There are no surprises, day in and day out. The only thing it is ever hoped you will do is win, place or show, and that you don't have much control over. It is in your blood, it is in your heart, it is in your fate-- or it is not.
And when it is not, then suddenly you are expected to be a civilized person in a fur coat. But people don't realize you may not even speak English. Some of you don't even know your names, because you didn't need to. You were not asked or told to do anything as an individual; you were always part of the "condo association?; the sorority or fraternity and everyone did everything together, as a group or pack. The only time you did anything as an individual is when you schooled or raced, and even then, You Were Not Alone.
Suddenly, he is expected to behave himself in places he's never been taught how to act. He is expected to take responsibility for saying when he needs to go outside, to come when he is called, not to get on some or all of the furniture, and to not eat food off counters and tables. He is dropped in a world that is not his, and totally without warning, at that.
Almost everything he does is wrong. Suddenly he is a minority. Now he is just a pet. He is unemployed, in a place where people expect him to know the rules and the schedule, even when there aren't any. (How many times have you heard someone say, "He won't tell me when he has to go out." What kind of schedule is that?) Have you heard the joke about the dog who says, "My name is No-No Bad Dog. What's yours?" To me that is not even funny. All the protective barriers are gone. There is no more warning before something happens. There is no more strength in numbers. He wakes up with a monster human face two inches from his. (With some people's breath, this could scare Godzilla.) Why should he not, believe that this "someone," who has crept up on him, isn't going to eat him for lunch? (I really do have to ask you ladies to consider how you would react if someone you barely knew crawled up on you while you were asleep?) No, I will not ask for any male input.
Now he is left alone, for the first time in his life, in a strange place, with no idea of what will happen or how long it will be before someone comes to him again. If he is not crated, he may go though walls, windows or over fences, desperately seeking something familiar, something with which to reconnect his life. If he does get free, he will find the familiarity, within himself: the adrenaline high, the wind in his ears, the blood pulsing and racing though his heart once again--until he crashes into a car.
Often, the first contact with his new family is punishment, something he's never had before, something he doesn't understand now, especially in the middle of the rest of the chaos. And worst of all, what are the most common human reactions to misbehavior? We live in a violent society, where the answer to any irritation is a slap, punch, kick, whip, or rub your nose in it. Under these circumstances, sometimes I think any successful adoption is a miracle.
He is, in effect, expected to have all the manners of at least a six-year old child. But, how many of you would leave an unfamiliar six-year old human alone and loose in your home for hours at a time and not expect to find who knows what when you got back? Consider that if you did, you could be brought up on charges of child abuse, neglect and endangerment. Yet, people do this to Greyhounds and this is often the reason for so many returns.
How many dogs have been returned because they did not know how to tell the adopter when they had to go out? How many for jumping on people, getting on furniture, counter surfing, separation anxiety, or defensive actions due to being startled or hurt (aka growling or biting)? So, let's understand: Sometimes it is the dog's "fault" he cannot fit in. He is not equipped with the social skills of a six-year old human. But with your love and help, you can make it happen.
Sarajean66 ...the above is a synopsis of a greyhound's life before she came to you. I think that once you read this article you will have a different understanding of why Rosie does what she does. When a greyhound is adopted into a new home, on the outside they may appear to be adjusting well but on the inside they may be stressed out trying to put this whole new world into perspective but she will do it and do it well.
Another site that is excellent reading particularly on behaviour is called "greyhound articles online" ... this site covers a variety of topics too.
And please don't hesitate to come on the forum if you have a problem or questions .... as sandysfarm stated, we have all been there at one point with our own greyhounds.
Taking this new information to heart, you and Rosie will strengthen the bond you already share.
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Post by campgreyhound on Sept 9, 2013 8:18:46 GMT -5
You've had good advice here for your girl. Let us know how it goes!
Shari, I was just about to post the Gilley article and I saw you'd done it lol
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Post by angelollie on Sept 9, 2013 16:37:20 GMT -5
Karen ... it's one of the best articles ever .... I think it says it all!! Wish we had this article some twenty years ago.
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sandysfarm
Grey Lover
positive reinforcement is theElegantSolution
Posts: 676
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Post by sandysfarm on Sept 9, 2013 16:54:17 GMT -5
Karen ... it's one of the best articles ever .... I think it says it all!! Wish we had this article some twenty years ago. Karen was't born 20 years ago.
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Redhead
Grey Lover
Teague (Natural Red Head)
Posts: 823
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Post by Redhead on Sept 10, 2013 16:07:19 GMT -5
Sorry this happened to you, I know it would make it very hard to trust your dog. I have heard the same story over and over on grey boards, you are definitely not alone. Dogs are never unpredictable, they are always showing us their feelings through their body language, and rarely (if ever) bite without warning. Most people consider a growl to be the only type, but their body and facial expression can tell you a LOT. Holding the head or ears back, licking lips, whale eye, etc. can all show that a dog is uncomfortable, and might bite. I don't think you have a vicious dog, just an uneducated one who doesn't quite understand what living in a house and sharing things in close contact means You can do a lot of desensitization training to help this, and it also sometimes just takes time.
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Post by newtothis1 on Sept 11, 2013 18:14:34 GMT -5
I think the article says it all. It is one of the best I have ever read. Don't give up on her and keep us posted on how everything goes.
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Post by campgreyhound on Sept 12, 2013 6:57:14 GMT -5
Karen ... it's one of the best articles ever .... I think it says it all!! Wish we had this article some twenty years ago. Karen was't born 20 years ago. Ha ha ha aren't you sweet lol
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