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Post by syd25 on Jun 20, 2012 18:17:42 GMT -5
Hi everyone. I've had my greyhound Sydney now for about a year and a half. I love him and would say that he is almost the perfect dog...with one exception...He loves to "play chase" with other dogs but what concerns me is that when he "catches" the other dog he will grab it by the neck (with him mouth) and push it down. He doesn't hurt the dog but seems to scare some. He is not aggressive...seems to love most dogs and people. I believe this is a sign of dominance but not sure what to do about it (if anything). He is not dominant with all dogs...only those that are the submissive type....in fact he will avoid dogs that bark at him. He is not dominant with me and has been easy to train. Any suggestions? Should this be cause for concern?
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carmasims
Grey Lover
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Post by carmasims on Jun 20, 2012 19:48:56 GMT -5
Oooh... It sounds like you have a chaser... I don't know if I'd continue allowing my greyhound to exhibit that kind of behaviour while playing with other dogs. It just takes one accident, or, one dog that isn't submissive, to create a large problem.
Sounds like he'd be better suited to either greyhound only runs where everyone's muzzled and it's controlled, or some training to see if you can edit that tendency out!
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ktel
Grey Puppy
Posts: 57
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Post by ktel on Jun 20, 2012 20:17:46 GMT -5
Hmm, I'm more of a let dogs be sort of person. Typically they can work it out amongst themselves and if one dog gets too rough, the other usually lets them know. I see so many people at the dog parks mistake play biting as aggression - dogs have teeth instead of hands, so that's what they use to play with each other. Without actually witnessing the behavior it's difficult to provide advice about where it lies on the aggression vs play scale.
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nimbyearl
Hound Nut
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Post by nimbyearl on Jun 20, 2012 21:41:40 GMT -5
Hmm, I'm more of a let dogs be sort of person. Typically they can work it out amongst themselves and if one dog gets too rough, the other usually lets them know. I see so many people at the dog parks mistake play biting as aggression - dogs have teeth instead of hands, so that's what they use to play with each other. Without actually witnessing the behavior it's difficult to provide advice about where it lies on the aggression vs play scale. Unlike other dogs this is not a good rule to follow with greyhounds. Especially when it comes to 'sorting it out'. Greyhounds are taught at a very early age to 'chase' and 'catch. They get very excited at the thought and most, and I'm not saying all, but the majority will not see this as 'play' and unfortunately, too many times, it ends in tragedy. My sincerest advice. Why chance it - I don't go to ANY dog park - expecially ones that are not 'greyhounds only'. Too many accidents where greyhounds are attacked and worse where the instinct kicks in and the pack mentality and other dogs are killed. Unless ALL dogs at any dog park aren't muzzled it is a very bad idea. These are my opinions based on my 10 years with greyhound experience and the fact that they are all based on actual events and experiences, some I have seen with my own eyes and it's not pretty. Why take the risk. Liz
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Post by rubylottie14 on Jun 21, 2012 13:16:56 GMT -5
I understand why you'd think 'let the dogs sort it out amongst themselves' but greyhounds aren't like other breeds - because of their breeding and training they are more likely to kill I think. I have seen my friends greyhound kill a fox - a big fox - and my greyhounds have killed cats and squirrels, and the dog that killed the fox nearly had a small fluffy dog - had we not intervened I'm sure Lily would have killed that particular dog.
I had Gerry (bridge baby) and he did exactly the behaviour that is being described here. He took down loads of the dogs we met. After having done this many times, I put him on the lead and muzzled him because I could see this was an accident waiting to happen. Gerry did not actually bite the dogs concerned but he held them firmly by the neck and took them to the ground. He was a BIG greyhound, 40 kilos and 33" to the shoulder so understandably any dog owner would be concerned to see this big dog pound towards them and then take their dog by the neck and to the ground.
I know from my experience that Gerry was not going to stop doing this and one day he might just take it too far. I would be beside myself if he had killed someone's dog or injured it. Ruby was off lead and the two of them would go into pack mode and really bully some dogs. Ruby on her own rarely does this and will always stop immediately I tell her 'no'. Gerry would start and she would join in.
It took me several months to come to terms with the fact that I had to have him on lead. I had Ruby to keep an eye on too and it was just too stressful for me waiting for Gerry to do this, often several times per walk.
I feel that I have a responsibility towards other people's dogs and if my dog does this then it's up to me to stop him from doing it.
I'd be terrified if I was on the receiving end of Gerry and it was my dog that was being 'hunted' like this.
I also want to promote greyhounds as pets and to let Gerry continue to do this just wasn't on.
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Post by Gigi on Jun 21, 2012 14:19:02 GMT -5
I agree with the others...and even with a "greyhound only" situation, and the greyhounds muzzled, there can still be problems if the greyhounds go into pack mentality mode. I have seen it a few times and hope I never see it again. And in a dog park, so many bad things can happen so fast and you can never undo the damage caused. BTW - Sydney sounds like a wonderful hound!
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OwnedBySummer
Hound Nut
"Summer" (aka Coach Standifer)
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Post by OwnedBySummer on Jun 21, 2012 15:43:05 GMT -5
Dog parks are scary places, IMHO. Summer only runs with other greyhounds in our local greyhound group (I'm very blessed with our local group and she gets to full-out run with them several times a week, otherwise it's zoomies and the lure pole in our back yard. Sometimes I take her alone to a diamond, hang my gates and my husband & I straight run her with a squawker & lure). And on-leash, small dogs can walk right under her and she doesn't care. But small dogs running around in a dog park? I'm pretty sure she'd take it out. If any of our neighbor's dogs got into our back yard, I wouldn't hold out too much hope for them, either -- I've seen how fast she can catch and kill a rabbit. I agree with Nimbyearl and other postersl! -- especially with the way you have described the behavior. Here's a link for a recent dogpark disaster. I believe the Lexus Project has stepped in. www.abc57.com/home/top-stories/Attack-at-Mishawaka-park-sends-three-dogs-into-emergency-surgery-159143225.htmlETA: I realize you didn't specify small or large dog so I'm making an assumption that it's smaller based on the description of the behavior. And with same size/large dogs, one stray tooth that would be nothing on a Labrador will have you taking a Greyhound to the E-vet. ETA2: I can only think of one other person who visits a dog park. Perhaps her method may work for you? First, she goes very early in the morning, before everyone shows up with their yappies. Say, 7am. She meets up with just a select two or three other people with similar size dogs that she's already learned they play well together and get along together. And they keep a very close eye on them even then. The humans have to know what they're watching for (body language, etc), not just having several dogs who get along.
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ktel
Grey Puppy
Posts: 57
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Post by ktel on Jun 21, 2012 15:45:17 GMT -5
I bring my greyhound to the dog park everyday, unmuzzled, without an incident. Like I said, it can be difficult for any of us to provide advice without witnessing the behavior, as dogs (even greyhounds) can really have a huge spectrum of behaviors. I'm lucky that my dog's behavior is great, but agree that I would probably stop taking him to the dog park if there were persistent problems. There are risks with taking ANY dog to the dog park, I have witnessed my fair share of pack fights break out. I am personally willing to take the risk, as I live in an apartment and want to give him a proper run, and I also want him to socialize with other dogs.
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Post by newtothis1 on Jun 21, 2012 17:22:08 GMT -5
I to take mine to the off leash and have only seen him focus on the small dogs a couple of times, as soon as I saw him look with intent, I called him back and he listened. This has not happened again after the first couple of times. There are also other greys at the park and there has not been any issues.
All that being said if you want him to have the chance to run, take him and leave his muzzle on. He won't mind and he will still get to have fun
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OwnedBySummer
Hound Nut
"Summer" (aka Coach Standifer)
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Post by OwnedBySummer on Jun 21, 2012 17:39:32 GMT -5
As many many people have posted about the "dog park and muzzles subject" on this and other forums... it's not recommended to take your grey to a dog park and muzzle just him. You will leave your dog defenseless should a situation arise.
Some suggestions are: You could go before anyone else and use a Chuck-It, if he'll chase a ball. Chuck-It makes a ball which whistles in the air, so he can chase it by both sight and sound. Or perhaps he'd have more fun with straight line running, where someone holds him at one side and someone else gets a lure and squawker going. There's also fun with a lure pole and you could do that in your own yard (equine lunge whip with a stuffy velcroed to the end of the lash). If he's a messy runner & has his dew claws, you might want to vet wrap his front legs before playing with a lure pole, though.
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Post by greypride on Jun 21, 2012 19:09:36 GMT -5
blitz is uninterested in small dogs she preferes to be near us and could care less of other dogs. however, dodger does the same thing as yours and she was fine and most owners realized it was just play until someone brought a long haired dachshund into the park.....yikes! it looked like a squirrel when it ran all fluffy and such. she chased it as it was running she picked it up and shook it. !!!!!!!!!! luckily we werent far from her and the yell i let out spooked her a little and she dropped the poor guy but he was in rough shape. poor thing will never trust parks again. so now we have her at the park and we BRING her muzzle. shes great with dogs beagle sized and larger so we dont usually put it on her, but anything smaller THE HUNT IS ON! now that shes caught another dog (like a squirrel) i think its done i dont see her behaviour changing so we use the muzzle when something small white and fluffy comes in (which isnt often) and shes fine. I usualy talk to the other people in the park and get a feeling of who they and their dogs are before i do it. muzzle on I keep a close eye on her , like summer said it can leave your dog defenseless against a big dog who might want to start a fight so make sure you use with caution and use your judgement of the types of dogs in the park and how they interact. But if you keep a close eye on your dog u can help protect and monitor whats happening. its always a good idea to watch your dog at the park anyways. my dogs unfortunately are not distracted by the toys in the park they like to run after the dog running after the toy. IT A RACE! with her muzzle dodger cant pick them up but she still gets to play with them. we have friends with small dogs (bostons frenchies shitzus) but in the home when shes playing theres no real room to chase its just wrestling so it doesnt get too prey-preditor-hunt in the home. if she gets too rough i usually just step in and snap my fingers and she knows its too much and backs off a bit. but ya long story short. they are trained to chase sometimes u cant change that but the muzzle is useful if you know when a good time is to use it. it allows them to socialize with small dogs without u worrying that some poor pooch is gonna get carried around like a squeek toy (thank dodger for that image)
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Midge
Grey Lover
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Post by Midge on Jun 21, 2012 19:09:42 GMT -5
You do your dog a disservice by not acknowledging the difference between a Retired Racing Greyhound and other dogs. This is a breed that has been bred for centuries for speed and agility. They have also been trained from an early age to do nothing but chase the little fluffy thing on a track. They have never seen another breed of dog, let alone a speedy little white fluffy one.
I'm not saying greyhounds should never go to an off-leash park but until you're absolutely sure of your dog, and it's body language, greyhound only gatherings really are the best ideas if you feel he/she needs the social interaction.
Personally, we avoid off-leash dog parks like the plague. There's a reason your vet will ask if you frequent dog parks at vaccination time.
syd25, my advice to you is to not go to the off-leash when smaller dogs are there. He may well be playing, or it may be a sign of dominance, but what would happen if the other dog startles and bites? Or Sydney gets carried away? As with children, it doesn't matter who started it.
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OwnedBySummer
Hound Nut
"Summer" (aka Coach Standifer)
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Post by OwnedBySummer on Jun 21, 2012 19:44:33 GMT -5
Personally, we avoid off-leash dog parks like the plague. There's a reason your vet will ask if you frequent dog parks at vaccination time. Glad you mentioned this (along with other good points)!
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Post by angelollie on Jun 23, 2012 14:24:53 GMT -5
I definitely agree with EVERYTHING that has been said against the use off-leash dog parks. To me, you are putting your hound in a situation where he has no choice but to react to his instincts and training. With all those smaller dogs running around, it's almost as if he were being tempted to carry out what he has been taught to do. This is not your hound's fault ... it has been a huge part of his training. Sydney is already carrying out certain parts of his training such as grabbing the dog by the neck and putting it to the ground. But I would be so leery of one day this reaction going another step further.
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Post by syd25 on Jun 24, 2012 12:43:25 GMT -5
Thanks for all the replies. I should clarify that I don't bring Sydney to the dog park...in fact we don't even have a dog park where we live (SSM, Northern Ont.). Unfortunately there aren't a lot of greys around these parts either. I will just have to muzzle him or intervene before the chase begins. I don't allow him to play with small dogs as he's too forceful.
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